The OP was calling for a Fediverse-wide boycott when this is how defederation works, and always has been (see hexbear comment above).
It is very annoying for myself and others to write out effort posts refuting shit these liberals spew on our platforms only to find out none of them will ever see it.
The issues I have with piefed are more related to the auto-collapsing comments based on votes, and the terrible search features, particularly its modlog. Seems way worse for transparency to have things that opaque and censorship happening through votes.
Question, do you feel comfortable posting in comms where other people are getting called degenerate roaches?
I believe there should be another community to report bad faith arguments made by any instance (!yepowertrippinbastards@lemmy.dbzer0.com , but broader), but I don’t have the time or energy for that.
From that link pretty much all of the usage is talking about the literal insect, or talking about reactionaries/fascists using it to refer to muslims, immigrants and other ‘undesirables’.
Out of the handful of remaining uses, it’s stuff like in the hexbear thread on this meanwhileongrad thread:
Like you might think I’m being melodramatic, but I really don’t see how meanwhileongrad isn’t a nazi bar.
As I said, I don’t have a dog in this fight, it seems indeed bad to have such comments on both sides.
I really hope you re-assess both sides, because they are not equivalent.
I understand, there’s plenty of problematic posters to go around, the issue I have is that it’s normalized calling an instance which is overwhelmingly trans and queer ‘degenerates’, that’s a major red flag, and it’s behavior like that which was why hexbear defederated shit in the first place.
Thank you for the detailed answer. I’m going to be honest, I don’t have the time to check all of this, and being insulted here in the last few days (https://lemmy.ml/modlog/14810) doesn’t really incite me to keep coming back to this thread (I made an exception for Jet as he didn’t have access to the other thread on SJW)
Coming back to the Piefed default blocking list, I investigated more, here is what an admin setting up an instance experience is like (https://wetshav.ing/comment/92409)
I’m on my computer now, so I’ll type out some more detail if you’re interested. To reiterate, I’m just going off memory and it was two weeks ago so I could very well be making stuff up…
The pre-filled input box asked for each blocked instance to go on a new line, so:
I deleted all of the defaults and that was it. I’ll put a screenshot of the settings page that’s available to admins below:
I agree it should be improved to make it fully optional, but it’s still acceptable for now. I guess we disagree on that, and that’s fine, hopefully one day the change will be made.
For the votes, I agree it should be an option, hopefully in the future it will be, but for now there are other priorities, and personally I’m not that impacted as the communities are in are usually smaller and without a lot of downvotes.
Question, do you feel comfortable posting in comms where other people are getting called degenerate roaches?
I’m going to be honest, I’m not the biggest fan of !meanwhileongrad@sh.itjust.works, I unsubscribed from it and this type of comments reminds me why. I ignore it most of the time, but yesterday I was curious to see what other people could think about this thread, and as expected, there was one. Where people were also incorrect about the way defederation is configured in Piefed, which is where I pasted the comment you mentioned.
I think Rimu is the same, he just got pinged into that thread, and answered there to clarify things, he doesn’t particularly endorses that community.
Let’s see how the mod answer, maybe there should be another community with moderation rules that ask to respect the humans, even though ideas can be criticized.
Or you could just leave the Nazi bar. shitsjustfash was federated for about two days with hexbear if I recall correctly and in that time we experienced dozens of their users posting: ableism, misogyny, homophobia, transphobia, racism, literal Nazi apologia in the form of the “clean Wehrmacht” myth, downplaying the genocide of indigenous people in the americas and the ongoing one in Palestine. So when they claim that we are denying a “genocide” of Muslims in China (there literally isn’t one and they don’t actually give a fuck about Muslims) it would be funny if these people weren’t all over places like piefed too and trying to ensure that nobody from anywhere like here can actually provide any counterfactual arguments to their Nazi propaganda.
And you. Yes you yourself, are all over here spamming your little copypasta trying to defend this decision and the BEST you can fucking do is “oh hmmmm I’ll look into it by asking the literal Nazi mod of shitsjustfash if they’re a Nazi, I’m sure they will be forthcoming and honest”
So you can admit that you have an anti-Lemmy.ml agenda, just not to me? Interesting. Yea, equating leftists to Nazis is a certified tell that you’re deeply unserious.
It’s the default setting for the echo chamber that I took issue with.
I did say that it was something admins can change manually in my initial post here, twice.
The OP was calling for a Fediverse-wide boycott when this is how defederation works, and always has been (see hexbear comment above).
The issues I have with piefed are more related to the auto-collapsing comments based on votes, and the terrible search features, particularly its modlog. Seems way worse for transparency to have things that opaque and censorship happening through votes.
Question, do you feel comfortable posting in comms where other people are getting called degenerate roaches?
Ok, so I got an answer from goat, which said basically that calling other people cockroaches happens on hexbear as well
https://hexbear.net/search?q=cockroaches&type=Comments&listingType=All&page=1&sort=New
It seems true from what I can see.
As I said, I don’t have a dog in this fight, it seems indeed bad to have such comments on both sides.
I usually avoid !meanwhileongrad@sh.itjust.works, those comments in that thread were the first I made there in a month (https://sh.itjust.works/search?q=+&type=Comments&listingType=All&communityId=25693&creatorId=2055038&page=1&sort=New )
I believe there should be another community to report bad faith arguments made by any instance (!yepowertrippinbastards@lemmy.dbzer0.com , but broader), but I don’t have the time or energy for that.
From that link pretty much all of the usage is talking about the literal insect, or talking about reactionaries/fascists using it to refer to muslims, immigrants and other ‘undesirables’.
Out of the handful of remaining uses, it’s stuff like in the hexbear thread on this meanwhileongrad thread:
This is the most questionable usage I found, and it’s referring to fash/reactionaries.
That’s not the main point though, the bigger issue was getting called a ‘degenerate’ that’s pretty much a red flag that someone’s a cryptofash.
citing db0 on this one:
compare the use of the term on shit vs hexbear: https://sh.itjust.works/search?q=degenerate&type=All&listingType=Local&page=1&sort=TopAll
https://hexbear.net/search?q=degenerate&type=All&listingType=Local&page=1&sort=TopAll
While looking I found this one on hexbear 5 years ago, almost 90 upvotes shitting on stalin for criminalizing homosexuality, and quoting him calling someone degenerate. I read this as extremely critical of Stalin:
All the usage on hexbear I see is either self-deprecating or discussing (negatively) about people using the term.
meanwhile on meanwhile on grad:
hmmm, calling people degenerates and complaining about commies, progressives and furries.
Goat seems fine with replies calling people he doesn’t like degenerates:
On the shit main community someone deleted their posts after getting called out for this behavior, this is a known issue:
‘degenerate tankie roaches’
site admin calls it out, entirely downvoted lol
Like you might think I’m being melodramatic, but I really don’t see how meanwhileongrad isn’t a nazi bar.
I really hope you re-assess both sides, because they are not equivalent.
I understand, there’s plenty of problematic posters to go around, the issue I have is that it’s normalized calling an instance which is overwhelmingly trans and queer ‘degenerates’, that’s a major red flag, and it’s behavior like that which was why hexbear defederated shit in the first place.
sh.it doesn’t seem to have improved in that time
Thank you for the detailed answer. I’m going to be honest, I don’t have the time to check all of this, and being insulted here in the last few days (https://lemmy.ml/modlog/14810) doesn’t really incite me to keep coming back to this thread (I made an exception for Jet as he didn’t have access to the other thread on SJW)
I summarized my view on the whole thing in this comment: https://lemmy.ml/post/35392790/20764278
Coming back to the Piefed default blocking list, I investigated more, here is what an admin setting up an instance experience is like (https://wetshav.ing/comment/92409)
lemmy.world lemmy.ml lemmygrad.ml hexbear.net lemmy.zip piefed.social etc...I agree it should be improved to make it fully optional, but it’s still acceptable for now. I guess we disagree on that, and that’s fine, hopefully one day the change will be made.
Modlog fitering has been added on 24th of August: https://crust.piefed.social/modlog
For the votes, I agree it should be an option, hopefully in the future it will be, but for now there are other priorities, and personally I’m not that impacted as the communities are in are usually smaller and without a lot of downvotes.
I’m going to be honest, I’m not the biggest fan of !meanwhileongrad@sh.itjust.works, I unsubscribed from it and this type of comments reminds me why. I ignore it most of the time, but yesterday I was curious to see what other people could think about this thread, and as expected, there was one. Where people were also incorrect about the way defederation is configured in Piefed, which is where I pasted the comment you mentioned.
I think Rimu is the same, he just got pinged into that thread, and answered there to clarify things, he doesn’t particularly endorses that community.
Let’s see how the mod answer, maybe there should be another community with moderation rules that ask to respect the humans, even though ideas can be criticized.
@goat@sh.itjust.works , do you support this kind of comments? https://sh.itjust.works/comment/20140833
Hmmm. Okay, I’m going to DM goat directly
Or you could just leave the Nazi bar. shitsjustfash was federated for about two days with hexbear if I recall correctly and in that time we experienced dozens of their users posting: ableism, misogyny, homophobia, transphobia, racism, literal Nazi apologia in the form of the “clean Wehrmacht” myth, downplaying the genocide of indigenous people in the americas and the ongoing one in Palestine. So when they claim that we are denying a “genocide” of Muslims in China (there literally isn’t one and they don’t actually give a fuck about Muslims) it would be funny if these people weren’t all over places like piefed too and trying to ensure that nobody from anywhere like here can actually provide any counterfactual arguments to their Nazi propaganda.
And you. Yes you yourself, are all over here spamming your little copypasta trying to defend this decision and the BEST you can fucking do is “oh hmmmm I’ll look into it by asking the literal Nazi mod of shitsjustfash if they’re a Nazi, I’m sure they will be forthcoming and honest”
Lemmy.ml doesn’t exist now?
Also, as I said above
So you can admit that you have an anti-Lemmy.ml agenda, just not to me? Interesting. Yea, equating leftists to Nazis is a certified tell that you’re deeply unserious.
Are you calling lemmy.ml Nazi propaganda?